The Charismanglican

I’m glad for the way you discussed this, especially that you included same-sex attracted voices.

My denomination (Episcopal/Anglican) is really struggling over this issue. If everyone would take the time to listen and love! Lord have mercy on us all.

Andrew

There’s so much to say on this topic, so I’ll try and be consise. Respectfully, I have to say that I think there was a lot of potential here for some amazing discussion and discourse on ideas; but somehow, that didn’t happen.

Everything presented seems to be presented through this particular church’s filter. That is, there was no mention of other churches or denominations that fully approve of being gay without conditions (ie., approving of “practicing” gays), nor did you include discussion on gay marriage – already legal in several US states and many countries around the world. And how about those societies and communities in those states? What about Christians there? How do they reconcile being Christians in a country/state that legally recognizes same-sex marriage, if their own interpretation of the bible tells them that that being gay is a sin? What about states that protect gays by creating anti-discrimination laws? Are those states protecting sinners? Are countries and states that allow gay marriage enabling sin?

It just seems to be that one view was presented here – this church’s view – and that this topic deserves a more wide-eyed and aware approach, rather than the somewhat folksy treatment the topic received here. You can still present your own view and church-specific message, but ulimately it would be far more educational and inclusive (particularly for a church that prides itself on inclusiveness) to include other Christian views in your discussion.

Jay

I watched this with interest and overall was very impressed. I did notice that while transgendered individuals were mentioned initially, there was no discussion on that. The Bible is strangely silent on the topic of transgender/transsexuality. It has been my experience that most transfolk transition to become gender-normative and want to live life authentically. I’d be interested to hear your views on this.

Jay

Thanks, Vince.

I’m looking for a new church home and yours was recommended to me. It’s hard to find one that isn’t judgmental or condemning, proclaims transgendered individuals as sexual deviants, which forbid transition or require de-transition, etc. On the other hand I’m encouraged by stories like these: http://www.oregonlive.com/living/index.ssf/2009/08/methodist_minister_confides_to.html andhttp://articles.latimes.com/2007/sep/09/nation/na-transgender9; as well as scientific information such as this:http://www.oregonlive.com/living/index.ssf/2009/08/methodist_minister_confides_to.html that show that transgender is a biological condition and that God has a plan for us.

Lisa

@Jay // I know a transgendered individual at Gateway (pre-op), and she has definitely felt accepted and loved there. During our 60/60 study (discussed in John’s book _Soul Revolution_), I was in a small group with her for a few months.

I hope if you attended Gateway you’d find that it’s a place where you could feel loved and accepted and where you could seek and question freely, just as anyone can. Hopefully you could learn to love God and love people there, just as we are all trying to do.

Jennifer

This is an amazing thing and I so appreciate the opportunity that this church is providing for those struggling and in the faith.

My personal experience was much different however. I grew up unchurch and unspiritual so when Jesus pursued me, healed me, changed me, and called me out of the life style I had already experience so many sinful choices that I was eager to continue my walk with Him.

When I went to find a church, I just went to the pastor and said this is who I am, where I’m at, and where I’m headed and if you cannot deal with that I’ll go some where else. He said that was fine and encouraged me to get involved.

I did and found a body who loved God but one that I could not relate to, not because I had just come out of the lifestyle but because this body was mostly made up of blue collar folks and I was an educated professional and not married. I couldn’t relate to the women (who were all having children) or the men (who didn’t understand the technical world I worked in). They did try to love me as best the could.

So after some seeking I found another church and used the same approach and ended up staying for over 14 years, got married there, had four children there, etc.

I have actually been wounded more by the gay community that I left than the church community that I moved into over time.

Blessings to this body who has found this good place to reflect God’s mercy and grace while holding the standard of behavior set by the Word.

Daniel M.

I don’t think I’ve ever heard of your church, but I’m grateful that you exist. That you have a culture of “come as you are.” I think that it’s very powerful, very effective and very biblical.
I’m an Admin of a private FB group for guys who have unwanted ssa. Unfortunately many (mostly those from the US) of them have a story of how the church has hurt them and let them down. All of them are still choosing to pursue God and many are still choosing to go to church…even if it’s not a good experience.

I completely agree with your closing statement. You’ve never met a heterosexual with so much faith. And this is why I rejoice with my ssa. There are few things more humbling. I think we as a group can have a huge impact on the world, if we can just get over our guilt and shame.

Thank you for taking your own step of faith…to talk about us. May God continue to use your church for His glory!

peace,
daniel

john r

sadly the pastor is speaking from mindset and belief system. he is an example of how even those who speak love can still have one foot firmly planted in the old covenant.

jesus didnt say we would know them by how they abided by old covenant regulation. instead he said “we would recognize them by their fruit” the fruit of the spirit that was in their lives.

in regards to romans…………homosexuals never have had women not from their earliest sexual memory. one cannot ABANDON something they never had. and their relationships are not motivated by shamebased lust but are instead motivated by mutual love, devotion, affection, trust, and respect for shared committed life together, the same as heterosexuals.

in essence committed believing homosexual relationships are filled with the fruit of the spirit in the same way that believing heterosexual relationships are.

the tension he talks about is between his mindset and his heart.

john r

vince

i get the impression that you have some image as to what love is.

jesus’s act’s of love included flogging the money changers in the temple, and willing submitting himself to torture.